Much like they are letting you start a deathknight at 55 - maybe have an option to start a toon at 40, once you have a level 70 character _on that server_ ? That way, it takes a large chunk of the grind out of the picture, it acts like a mini gold sink for top tier toons - as they have to gear up the level 40 character, and it leaves a good amount of the grind still to go, so that way it's not completely EZ mode, just less boring mode....

So true. I think once you hit 70 every character after that should come in as 70. You have already experienced leveling so why make you go through 6 weeks of doing the same thing again? Just give us the option of making a 70 right out of the gate.

"So true. I think once you hit 70 every character after that should come in as 70. You have already experienced leveling so why make you go through 6 weeks of doing the same thing again?"

I gotta say ... Personally, I think that's a little ridiculous. I do, however, agree that starting from L1 all over again is equally ridiculous.

I like the compromise Doc suggested above, in which a player with an L70 could create an L40 and get started much sooner. That seems like an excellent point at which to get started: You've got your Mount, many classes get their upgraded Armor training ... Just plain sensible.

Here's what I think would make sense: Maybe if you reached L70 with your first Character, then all Characters *of the same Race* could then begin at 70, while Character of *other races but the same Faction* would begin at L30 or L40.

For example: If you have an L70 Draenei Priest, you could then create an L70 Draenei Paladin, or an L40 Human Warrior. You could not, however, create an L40 Orc Hunter without running through the Horde starting quests / areas and hitting L70 - at which point, that L70 Orc Warlock and L40 Troll Shaman you'd planned on would become available.

Lastly, these characters could come with "prefab," same-name Armor sets, much like the DK's starting Green / Blue Armor. That way, you're off to a solid start, but you can still PvP, grind, and Raid for (and celebrate when you find) better gear.

Make sense?

@ Badger

Good point. Anything but starting over again would be welcome. L40 or L70 same race would be fine, just not 0 again. Sure the first 20 level come quickly but after that it feels like a grind.

@Badger

I understand what your saying about the once levelled a race, always levelled, but to me it seems wiser to do that class style. So I level a NE Hunter. Get him to 70, why not then turn around and use that rule and get a Druid. I think it would be better to do, once you've levelled a hunter, all later hunters afterwards would be 70 to start. That way, no instant druids. Because, quite frankly, there is no comparison to a Druid and a Hunter, even though both of them are beast oriented. And getting a level 70 Druid is quite confusing, as I have experienced on the Test realms. Even getting a 70 of a class you are fairly familiar with can be intimidating, much less one you haven't levelled yet.

I agree, I don't want to start in the outlands I like working my up from the start. How ever there are people who would like that choice and I got no problem with that, but having them redo all the old area's new quest ect... then adding onto them with new places to go, would be awesome. Why should expansion packs only be about high level stuff? Why not add a whole new lowbie area, and lowbie things that make players want to start over, not only to give brand new players people to group with, but keep the old stuff alive and not just letting it die.

So true. I tried leveling my Shaman Resto and made it to 40 before wanting to gouge my heart out with a spoon because it was so painful. Dual wielding enhance is so much more enjoyable until I can respec to resto again at 70.

I think it really depends on the player - I tried leveling a Paladin as both Ret and Prot... Neither works for me. IMO, both of those specs are simply horrible for leveling, but as Holy it's a walk in the park for my play style.

What you're saying there about the point of the leveling process, I agree with, and I feel the boosts they have made to leveling speed leads to more 'noobs' at 70. I leveled most of my characters pre-2.0, and yes, the speed of leveling was agonizing at times, but it was a rite of passage.

Making it through to 60 really meant something, not many people had more than one 60 back then. Now? I have 6 level 70's and 5 more characters between 55-65. Am I expected to be 'pro' at all of the classes I have at 70? I sure hope not, as some of them I'm not really that great at. The same has happened to others as well. They know the basics of the class, but they really don't excel at it. Previously, we had all the time in the world to devote to our precious level 60.

There is also a downside to the increase in leveling speed. Just the other day in a wowinsider post, they were discussing how by the time you get ready to do an instance (pre-BC), you've out-leveled the place, and many people never get to see the old instances their first time through the game. Blizzard has also removed almost all group quests pre-BC, which in addition to few people going to old instances, means many players seldom, and sometimes never, group up with others. This leads to people who don't know their role(s) in parties, and bad PuGs in Outlands.

This isn't a universal thing. Some players can pick up WoW for the first time and be pro from day one, and that's fine, but it doesn't generally occur.

As for "after you have a 70", I feel that what -should- have happened is either no experience/leveling speed buffs OR that only players who have gotten to 70 at least once got the buff. First time players should have to suffer through a longer leveling process to get to know their class.

I'm also of the school of thought which feels there needs to be 'attunements' for leveling (UNrealistic example: To gain experience beyond level 20, you must successfully defeat VanCleef in Deadmines). Something, anything, to get players to group and overcome challenges to progress through the game, aside from simple grinding/solo questing. It's an MMO for a reason.

In your second paragraph, were you saying that talent specs should be more permanent? I like the idea, except for the fact that many first-time players might "mess up", like the people who thought you're supposed to fill up every box in all three trees, until someone corrects them at level 46... It would definitely allow players more time to become accustomed to their specs, and likely better once they hit the end-game.

As for the others who want to start at a higher level? I just don't think it should happen. A level 40/50/60/70 with no/white armor, and no gold of its own, no professions... A character should be able to get by without support from alts, and it doesn't sound like fun to have to start your character at level 50 and have to go back to Elwynn/Tirisfal/etc to farm Peaceblooms/Copper and skill up from there for hours/days/weeks (depending on your ability to skill up professions) in order to get to your starting level's skill range. Sure you could just proceed to go to level 70/80 and then go back, but leveling professions, for many, is much easier if done while leveling the character (enchanting, anyone?)

"You should be able to transfer soulbound items after that to your alt."

This would enable players to use their T6 player to roll/bid/dkpbuy T6 tokens and give them to their just-hit-70-in-greens alt. Talk about very imba!

i'd like to disagree with you. i'm leveling my fourth toon to 70 right now and i'm dreading going to outland. i think azeroth allows much more freedom in where and how you can level and outland is a very narrow constricting environment. since they made the changes to the leveling curve, you'll often find yourself outleveling content instead of scrambling to fill up your time wondering where you should go next. this frees you up to skip the stuff you don't like. since those leveling changes none of my toons have set foot in stv, desolace, blasted lands, searing gorge, or burning steppes to level. in outland though, i have no choice but to do all those water quests in zangarmarsh, all the boring quests outside auchindoun, and every quest in the hated blade's edge. i'm even getting sick of nagrand at this point. in azeroth there are always new quests to discover and little corners to find that you may have missed before. if it seems boring, maybe you're just doing the same quests you've always done..

and i'm not sure how you're having so many problems finding groups. in the last couple months i've had no trouble finding groups for ZF, ST, etc. on a midpop server playing horde. maybe you play at 900am on weekdays? :)

Pre TBC on my server (Bonechewer), there was never any trouble grouping for ANYTHING in Azeroth.

BFD, BRD, RFD, RFK, ULDA, ZF, SM Cath, SM Arm, SM Lib, SM Grave, UBRS, LBRS, Scholo, Undead Strat, Living Strat, Stockades, VC(Deadmines), DM Tribute, DM North, DM East, DM West.

The things that were hard to group for were ZG, AQ20, MC and any of the end-game raids.

Now it is the opposite in some ways. It is nigh on impossible to find ANYONE to group for any instances in Azeroth at all, and even harder to find groups for instances in Outland that aren't heroic dailies, or 10 man Raids.

Even the majority of outland is completely dead. All of the levelling Zones are dead. Everyone is at 70 and flying so you barely see anyone anymore.

Instances are there to break up the grind and make levelling easier / faster, however noone goes to levelling dungeons anymore.

Something needs to be done

ummmm... you leveled as a holy spec'd priest? it is your own fault that it was as bad a grind as it was

@4 Ootter

For the most part, I levelled as Shadow, but I did respec to Holy a few times to run instances, mostly to acquire some rudimentary experience of healing so as not to end up at Level 60 without having healed anything in my life.

I've always levelled a bunch of other chars - some of them DPS classes - to 60, and, always, Azeroth was about the least pleasant experience of my leveling life.

I have 3 70's , 2 62's and a 61. The increased leveling from 20-60 is really nice. but once you hit 60..ugh. 60-61 feels like 50-60. I'm hoping when wrath hits that the decreased XP required to level will be from lvl 20-70.