There's a storm brewing over in the UI & Macros forum, and it's about the terms of use for popular add-on site Curse. If you use mods at all, you're almost certainly aware of the site; I go there all the time. They're probably the biggest mod site right now. So it comes as something of a surprise to me that such a pillar of the scene would have what seems to be a pretty abusive set of terms service. According to the analysis conducted in this forum thread, Curse's ToU "specifically removes any and all copyright that we as authors have on our addons." Yikes!
There are other bad parts of the ToU language too, including that Curse can change the ToU at any time without notifying authors. Of course, the site is within its rights to impose any ToU it wants on the users, but it's not nice to take control of creations out of authors' hands. I am not a lawyer, so it's altogether possible that I'm interpreting some of this incorrectly. The forum thread, however, claims that lawyers looked at Curse's terms and agreed that the interpretation is correct.
Until these provisions are changed -- and Curse promises that they will be -- I recommend mod authors use other sites like WoWInterface or wowui.incgamers.com. In writing this article I read the terms of use for those sites -- or rather, tried to. IncGamers doesn't even have their ToU up! But they've been a pretty well-behaved site in the past (they used to be worldofwar.net), so I trust them. WoWInterface's terms of service didn't seem to have anything like what Curse has, and a source at the site assured me that "we never touch an author's zip file without their knowledge and consent, ever." WI has a good history of respecting the community and the authors. Curse folks, are we all reading this wrong? Is there something in this issue that's being missed?
Update: As several of Curse's employees have helpfully pointed out to me, the new ToU are much better. However, I still have reservations about them.
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
2-16-2008 @ 7:13PM
Sean Riley said...
I downloaded my first addon from Curse ever today.
And I am now worried I've been hacked, almost immediately thereafter.
Guys, say it, say it again: Stay the hell away from Curse. Use WoWInterface.
And can someone please get FlagRSP2 up on WoWInterface?
Reply
2-16-2008 @ 7:38PM
Denniz said...
If you don't have anything better to say, then don't!
2-16-2008 @ 7:36PM
dotted said...
This has nothing to do with keyloggers, its pure licensing manner between addon author and Curse Inc.
Btw new ToU:
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=2844496448&postId=28434213451&sid=1#1
2-16-2008 @ 7:58PM
FriendlySoviet said...
Curse: Hackers on Steroids.
2-16-2008 @ 8:16PM
Pzychotix said...
@Sean:
HINT: It was the mod. Not Curse.
2-16-2008 @ 8:25PM
Sean Riley said...
Psychotix, I fail to understand your point. If I downloaded an addon from Curse and was summarily hacked (which, more and more, I admit was a hasty assumption on my behalf) then frankly, this still reflects badly on Curse.
2-16-2008 @ 9:40PM
Sean Riley said...
I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise for my comments in this thread. They were hasty, irrational, and without merit.
I was panicked, paranoid, and worried. As it turns out, it's looking like I was panicked over nothing. Let's hope this turns out to be true.
But as noted, I apologize sincerely for everything.
2-17-2008 @ 11:28AM
CurseSucks said...
Curse is horrible, not only do they rip off WoWHead with this crappy wowdb thing - now they are ripping off independent mod developers
/spit on curse
YOU SUCK
2-16-2008 @ 7:34PM
JM said...
The terms was already changed. This was brought up to Curse recently -- things take time. Eliah, we understand you are pro-wowhead, wowinterface and all that, but you're really just making yourself look stupid. I suppose 'wowinsider' is blog-based so your personal vendetta's might be okay. Eventhough you look extremely silly and it's like you try everything to flame nice websites.
There's a lack of news today as well. Even then, find other things to post about!
Sean,
What does getting hacked have to do with this? On Curse.com every single addon is scanned and checked by the Curse staff before approved. They are safe. Again, it's silly to assume things. Get your own impression instead of listening to someone who obviously had a bad childhood.
Reply
2-16-2008 @ 7:37PM
Eliah Hecht said...
Hi JM. So can you tell me why the terms were so abusive in the past, even if they're being changed now? According to the forum thread, at some point in '07 Curse was even reserving the right to *sell* people's mods without their permission! You must agree that's not very nice.
It is not my intention to flame anybody. Sure, I have favorite sites. And yes, my posts are based on my own opinions. But if Wowhead or anyone else did something I found highly questionable, I would certainly post about it. It's not my fault that these two recent controversies have centered around Curse sites.
Finally, you say the terms were already changed, but this is still in there: "you grant Curse, Inc. a worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free license to use, reproduce, distribute, display and perform such content on Curse Website (or its successors and affiliates)", and it goes on in this manner. Care to comment?
2-16-2008 @ 7:42PM
dotted said...
Eliah LOL - If you remove distrubute from the ToU, how is Curse to distrobute mods to people? If you remove display from the ToU how is Curse to show screenshots from addons?
2-16-2008 @ 7:48PM
Eliah Hecht said...
dotted, the part that I'm concerned about is that the whole tone of that paragraph seems to imply that Curse is going to keep your mod up and do whatever they want with it forever. For instance, later it says Curse can continue to distribute files you delete, for any reason, anywhere, at any time. Shouldn't authors retain control over when, where, and how their files are offered for download?
2-16-2008 @ 7:55PM
dotted said...
It doesnt say that no
"The aforementioned license granted by you terminates once you remove or delete a User Submission from Curse Website. You also acknowledge that Curse, Inc. may retain, but not display, distribute, or perform, server copies of User Submissions that have been removed or deleted. In addition you acknowledge and grant users of the Curse Websites a non-exclusive license to access your User Submissions through the Curse Website (or its successors and affiliates) and to use such User Submissions as applicable by their respective licenses."
Curse may retain the addon on their servers, but not use it for anything.
2-16-2008 @ 7:57PM
Foxlit said...
Eliah: The sentence after the one you quoted reads "The aforementioned license granted by you terminates once you remove or delete a User Submission from Curse Website.", which doesn't seem to match your conclusion ("... Curse can continue to distribute files you delete, for any reason, anywhere, at any time. "). Perhaps you were confused by the sentence after that - "You also acknowledge that Curse, Inc. may retain, but not display, distribute, or perform, server copies of User Submissions that have been removed or deleted." - but even so, that explicitly does NOT grant Curse permission to continue to distribute content that has been removed by the author.
Your concerns seem unfounded, and rooted in a not-too-thorough reading of their Terms of Use. JM seems to be right - you do look silly.
2-16-2008 @ 7:58PM
Eliah Hecht said...
Yes, you're right, Foxlit, I did misread there. However, it still stands that Curse is going to do whatever they want with your files before you delete them. I also wonder why they want to retain your files after you delete them, even if they're not doing anything with them.
2-16-2008 @ 8:11PM
dotted said...
Eliah - Read again Curse cant do what ever they want, why Curse wants to be able keep an addon on the server after deletion could be because of self protection, what i mean is if an author found out his addon was still on curse after he had it removed he cant sue Curse for keeping it. Or it could be required be law, im not an american so i dont know about american laws (like if some weird crime was commited and a user submission (not necessarily an addon) was evidence in the case, then it would be bad is the user submission was deleted).
But as i've stated im not an expert on american law, so dont quote me on this.
2-16-2008 @ 8:13PM
Foxlit said...
I believe the right to retain content after deletion is a simple effort to prevent liability if the content isn't immediately removed from the servers themselves (Curse is no doubt mirrored heavily, there's no telling when removed content is actually physically removed);
I believe you're translating "a worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free license to use, reproduce, distribute, display and perform such content on Curse Website (or its successors and affiliates)." to "to do whatever they want with your files before you delete them." -- in fact, it appears to be a simple right to display and distribute your content; again, they would be liable if they allowed people to download copyrighted addons without that clause. Note the lack of rights to modify -- the grant is limited to more or less making the files available for download until you remove them.
2-16-2008 @ 8:13PM
Sean Riley said...
It was meant to be more a general continuation of the bad impression I have of Curse. I regret posting what I did now, though, since it may (of course) not be due to curse, or maybe not even a hack.
I'm scared, though.
2-16-2008 @ 7:35PM
rick gregory said...
The terms of use have nothing to do with being hacked. Don't start false rumors that have no basis in anything. And learn what you're talking about please...
Reply
2-16-2008 @ 8:15PM
Sean Riley said...
I'm not trying to link the two, save by a general dislike of Curse.