Ever since Arena Season 3 started, it seems as though everyone else in the battlegrounds has mostly epic gear. I myself have just a few now, but strangely I feel less powerful than I did before all the new gear became available. Perhaps a lot of the people I used to beat had been saving up their honor and arena points a lot longer than I had, so now they all out-gear me by a wider margin. Or maybe I've just been unlucky in the teams I've been matched against.Either way, it strikes me that newcomers and casual gamers just now hitting 70 must be having a terrible time in PvP. They sign up for their first matches with their mix of greens and blues, and find themselves like a mouse before lions, with every opponent decked out in the kind of gear they only dream of attaining. Even if they really want to, is there any chance for them to learn how to PvP when they get killed in just a few seconds? Furthermore, even if they have the dedication for it, they may feel like leech on their team, kind of like a level 61 player in Alterac Valley, who knows all to well that he or she can't really contribute that much -- except the newcomer to level 70 is already at the level cap. The only way they can improve at PvP is to somehow get matched up with good enough teams to carry them trough many many battles until they finally have enough points to buy some good gear. If not, they get virtually nil from losing all the time no matter which battleground they join. Of course they may keep losing at the Arenas for a few months until they finally accumulate enough points to buy a few pieces of gear, but in the meantime their opponents are winning and saving up points a lot faster than they are.
If there's no way to shape up, can they only ship out? Are the doors of entry into end-game PvP completely shut off in the face of newcomers? If such a person came to me asking what they should do, I could only suggest they try to maintain a positive attitude, keep doing their best, and possibly get new gear from PvE as much as they can. I might also remind them that another expansion is coming next year, which should level the playing field. How would you advise a new level 70 to get into PvP?
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
11-29-2007 @ 3:08PM
Slayblaze said...
Probably the best way would be to do BG's until you have enough honor to purchase a full S1 arena set. Not a perfect plan, but certainly the most likely place to start.
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2-09-2008 @ 11:05AM
Dale said...
I agree and am doing something very much like this. I do not play in the arena's and most likely never will but I do play in the BG's a LOT. with nearly 11,000 pvp kills and growing. When I hit 58 and was headed to Hellfire Pen my gear was wacked and it was hard to survive even the first few quests. But this did give me some reasonable gear. I am how ever a pvp player and even this gear was not what I had hoped. Then I saw the lvl 60 epic in the pvp awards and drooled on my keyboard. I will not saw this stuff is uber but the set give you some NICE bonuses and BG's are alot more forgiving as you try to gear up then arena's.
11-29-2007 @ 3:15PM
Nick S said...
as a fairly new 70 in mixed greens and blues, all i can say is YES.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:16PM
npm said...
I totally agree. They should really do some sort of gear matching and/or point matching in arena.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:53PM
Freehugz said...
there is point matching
11-29-2007 @ 4:30PM
Blake said...
There already is point matching. And you can start earning honor in your teens if I recall correctly (I never PvPed in my early seasons). With AV at level 51? you can farm honor there and you should have more than enough points for some season 1 gear along with some Vindicator's gear.
On top of that, skill also counts a lot in battlegrounds. It's nice to have epic S3 gear, but you also need skill to get a good rating. Also, you can throw a season away if you want - just join 2v2, 3v3 & 5v5 teams, spend a season learning the tricks of the trade, earning points every week and when the new season starts, you should have enough points to buy new gear and voila! you're a top-geared player. With the new season, you should get a new personal rating and with your new gear, you can work your way up to the best gear in the PvP game.
Sure you're at a disadvantage when you first hit 70, but within a season, that disadvantage should disappear.
11-29-2007 @ 3:19PM
Callandra said...
Hunter here, so take that into consideration. Dinged 70 last night. Had Valanos', Glad shoulders and blue bracers equipped within 1 minute.
Glad chest piece tomorrow at 8am.
Ran AV last night, 6th on the damage list. PvP is easy.
Newbs can contribute easily to AV (if they are healers), otherwise try to get your marks in te 60-69 bracket
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11-29-2007 @ 3:20PM
thush said...
I'm in that situation with a reroll right now. I've noticed a huge difference since the S1 gear went up for honor points and marks. I would also agree that the best thing to do is just grind it out until you can buy some better gear with your honor and/or arena points. Reminds me of pre-battlegroup PvP on the old honor system with my warrior. I hit 60 and was getting trashed by premades and people rockin' T2. Slowly Rank 6 came, Rank 8, then Rank 10 and my warrior started killing people. Just be patient and put in the time.
Also, if you can heal you can help out a lot more than you think. If you're a hybrid go resto/holy and keep people alive until you can buy the gear for your favorite spec.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:21PM
Braz said...
The best advice I can give to new and/or casual players is not to wait until lv.70 to start learning BG/Arena PvP. Learn the basics of pvp combat for your class in the lower level brackets where the gear/experience disparity isn't as severe, and then move up to lv.70. Waiting to start PvP at 70 is like trying to play your first game of football in the NFL, and I don't envy anyone who makes the mistake of leveling too soon.
I would also recommend saving your points to buy the S1 gear if nothing else, so that you will be more able to compete against those who already have the gear.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:24PM
Tabuti said...
Well you have a couple of options here...
1. Save up all the honour you get while you lvl and twink out a little once you hit 69. This way you won't run into an ms war with 300+ resilience. This is a good way to get all the honour you need!
2. I'm pretty sure that the matching system blizz has in place is working. But on a scaled down version. Once the number of pvpers goes up they could increase the restrictions.
I remember this happening pre bc with the change from rank based rewards to points based. You saw in influx of newly geard noobs.
One great thing is that people do learn.... ie if you keep running into that group of 10 ally they will destroy you very quickly but if you stick with your team mates you seem to live longer and get heals!
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11-29-2007 @ 3:24PM
Rene said...
Since it is possible to buy S1 gear with honor now, I decided to grind honor and marks with my hunter (lvl 65 at the moment), so I'll be able to replace my greens/blues with epic quality gear when I hit 70. I have barely any experience in PvP, never liked it and never played much. So here I am, in Alterac Valley, with a 65 hunter against mostly 70s with much better gear. Still, I am much more successful than I thought. I usually end up in the top ten (counting killing blows). After playing for a few days I already have half the honor and marks I need for the equipment.
Of course it is possible that all the people in my battlegroup are as lame as I am.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:24PM
Wirehead said...
Er.
It's really not that bad, folks.
Arenas are SUPPOSED to be very difficult. Even experienced players with good gear get annihilated.
The progression is supposed to go Battlegrounds to Arena. If you ding 70 and walk into a RANKED arena match, you should EXPECT to get owned, just like the vast majority of even experienced players do.
If you feel you're not staying alive long enough to learn anything, then do practice (non-ranked) matches in Arenas. That's what they're for.
Get a few PVP pieces from BG's and lose your 10 games a week for a couple of weeks, get a piece or two of arena gear, and go have fun.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:28PM
Dotixi said...
I don't PVP very often, but last night I decide to hit WSG for the daily and everyone except me was decked out in purples...I died a lot.
I am a solo player so I only have blues and greens from quests or 5-mans. Currently, I am saving for a wand. I have 14000 honor saved from the days when I was grinding marks from AV so now all I need are 10 Eye of the Storm Marks. I here The Eye is long...
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11-29-2007 @ 4:33PM
Blake said...
Yes, those EOTS marks are a pain to get. Best bet is to hit it up on an EOTS weekend. Still, I just spent 10 marks to get the Vindicator's Pendant of Conquest and though I'd love to have the boots, I'm not going to spend time in there getting 40! marks.
11-29-2007 @ 3:28PM
Grimia said...
I'd add in Halaa! You're going to want to get that +10 res gem to stick in some gear at somepoint, so go start some PvP there. Heck, you can even get 2 starter pieces of PvP gear there.
But as someone else said, you can still help out in AV while getting your honor points for the S1 gear and otherwise learning.
If you've been 70 for a while, there's also doing heroics for the PvP cloak and trinket, along with running some non-heroics for some of the PvP gear that drops (a sword in BM, runed fungal cap in UB, etc).
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11-29-2007 @ 3:28PM
Jellodyne said...
Um, how about just 'expect to lose for a while while you're new'? I mean, it's not only gear issues. PVP is a totally different game than PVE with different stategies, a much faster pace and a different mindset.
Are the doors shut? Are there even any doors? Its not like PVP gear is hard to get. Season 1 stuff can be had through grinding now, no skill required. You can even afk seasoin 1 gear, if you're a tool. And all of season 2 and most of 3 can be had simply by losing 10 matches a week or so, reforming a new 1500 rank team as neccesary, or letting the season reset do it for you. Can you install the game and start off as an arena god? No, but you can get the GEAR a lot quicker than it took you to level to 70, and a lot quicker than it would take you to get comparable gear via PVE. Man up, put in your time and get your stuff. Then maybe work on learning to play.
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11-29-2007 @ 3:30PM
Uncle Vinny said...
I didn't PvP on my holy priest until I'd been level 70 for a while, so I had a lot of catching up to do. I did BGs quite a lot, mostly AV, and kept steadily upgrading my PvP gear (belt/boots/bracers) whenever I had the chance. One thing that helps is keeping track of what armor/weapon pieces would benefit most from an upgrade... make a list, keep your priorities straight, and don't just grab the shoulders 'cuz they "look cool".
I also got lucky with a few nice +resil drops in instances.
Once I had a little +sta/resil gear, I started doing 3v3 and 5v5 arenas with guildies. We were awful, but the points started rolling in. Now I have ~10k health and 365 resilience, and I can survive much much longer than I used to.
Take a look at Arenajunkies.com for great discussions on your class, too. I learned a lot from those guys.
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12-11-2007 @ 1:43PM
Sparks said...
About the recommendation to upgrade your items so that you are constantly getting the most bang for you buck, i.e. the biggest upgrades...that's definitely what I recommend for hard core players who are aiming to climb the ranks quickly. However, for most players, who are simply looking to have a good time, try this approach. Buy the cheapest available upgrades as quickly as you can. What this does is make the process more fun, even though you may end up needing more points in the end because you upgrade something twice. For example, you may want the S3 arena chest armor, but that's a ton of arena points which are hard to get quickly. Instead, farm honor points and buy the S1 arena chest. Once you have that S1 chest you'll find that farming arena points is easier and more fun because you have the resilience that you need to compete. In the end you buy two arena chest pieces instead of just one, but hey, that's how the more seasoned players did it in the first place.
11-29-2007 @ 3:35PM
Scruffy said...
This whole 'The better you and your gear is, the better you kill, and get better gear' thing ruins arena.
"Arena" makes it sound like some sort of fair competition, matched levels and what not. It's more like a pyramid scheme where anyone up top makes off with everything worthwhile. This wouldn't be a problem except that it simply makes them even more powerful in the arena.
Arena should have been with premade gear sets only. Talent however you want and pick pieces from sets tailored to one of your talent trees. Everything else will be a matter of team makeup and skills, not epics loaded with epic gems and 500G enchants.
srly phail bliz :(
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11-29-2007 @ 4:19PM
Tridus said...
That'd be fun.
The game desperately needs an environment for PvP where gear is not a factor. AKA: real skill based PvP.
Before BC what we had was raid guilds stomping everybody else. Now its people who already have arena gear stomping people who don't.
Either way, they should remove the gear from the equation. What they've done now is just made it worse, since arena gear is so high level that someone in blues doesn't have much of a chance.