After a bad run of battlegrounds recently, I began wondering why so many players are so reluctant to play defensively. I myself generally prefer offensive maneuvers, but I see the value in having a solid defensive base. I personally have neglected to play defense, because every time I do, I feel like everyone else thought "oh good! now I don't have to". Then my character gets zerged, and spanked. Hard. Sometimes there is laughing.Of course, this sort of begs the question doesn't it? If we're all not playing defense because we feel we'd end up alone, then we are ensuring any defense will indeed go it alone (and fail). Are we suffering from poor leadership, or are there other reasons why so many of us are so genuinely reluctant?
When speaking with some of my guildmates on the issue, they mentioned that you don't feel very useful when you are run over by a group from the other side. It's hardly how one wants to spend an evening. Offense also sees more continuous action, as defensive positions sometimes have long periods of time where there is no one to kill. Failing that, you may also spend a great portion of the match being killed.
We have previously talked about how you might go about designing a new battleground. Would there be any merit to designing one where defense is more important, to force players to learn its value and its technique? Or, on the other hand, would it be beneficial and interesting if we had a battleground based solely on offensive maneuvers?
Do you prefer defense, or offense, and why? Why do you think the defensive seems to be the least popular choice? What do you think, if anything, could be done about it?
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 4)
11-29-2007 @ 8:14AM
LesCranpool said...
I prefer defense simply because it allows me to use the bathroom and get drinks and read things and generally not pay much attention when farming honor or marks.
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11-29-2007 @ 8:16AM
JPN said...
I just do it myself and shut up. No one cares if you complain and it doesn't help. I find as a rogue, I'll stay at a base in stealth alone, and sometimes get some cocky solo player from the other team who thinks there's an empty base they can grab, then I pop em and they run. Usually a good player on my side will see this and hang with me. And, I find it's better to hang out somewhere, in AB for example, and say "5 inc farm" if I can't handle it, then at least I've done my part, which is all you can do.
People don't do it cause it's not as fun. There's a lot of standing around. You don't get any kind of benefit, besides, you know, getting towards your goal of BG marks 3x faster....
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11-29-2007 @ 8:16AM
Pook said...
The main problem i see with expecting ppl to defend an objective is, unless the horde come and attack you've got - nothing to do & your getting no additional honor.
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11-29-2007 @ 1:11PM
DrDiesel said...
Pook, Pook, Pook... j/k man. I'm with ya. What Blizz needs to look at is offering a bonus or something to those that do defend. I don't mean camping and going AFK, but actively defending. Maybe that would make it a more desirable activity.
I too find myself defending a lot more than most, but as a Mage that can be a dangerous prospect.
11-29-2007 @ 8:17AM
LFD said...
I have had it with the BGs, especially AV, because most don't want to defend the frackin' towers and graveyards. They fail to realize that no towers = no honor. Btw, I play Alliance, I guess that explains it.
/rerolls Horde
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11-29-2007 @ 9:30AM
Brooks said...
Same problem on our side, at least in my Battlegroup. No one apparently wants to listen to the veterans who've been playing since AV came out that, oh man, defense actually wins a game!
A solid defense just leaves the other team's offense turtling on a single point and at the very least you'll win by slowly, but surely, ticking down their reinforcements.
11-29-2007 @ 8:22AM
Ryan said...
Because I keep getting tagged 'afk'.
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11-29-2007 @ 8:56PM
Dadz said...
Keep moving and they won't think you're AFK.
11-29-2007 @ 8:24AM
Scarcheek said...
I play defense if others are. I need variety of play, and waiting for people to attack as defense can get boring - I need action. I'll go join a defensive team if help is called, though.
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11-29-2007 @ 8:24AM
Keiji said...
I usually defend a lot.. thou it's frustrating stand alone there, watch those 5 offence coming, yelling the inc, get zerged and keep jumping from gy. XD But sometimes there are nice ppl that help you defence and you can screw some offence. That feels good. ;)
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11-29-2007 @ 8:36AM
Gareth said...
Love playing defense too in AV although its rare we have a large enough team to really damage the Alliance Zerg, delaying it does feel really good - and reclaiming the graveyards feels like winning the match, which is normally does lead to.
I don't defend often in AB or EoS simply because I play a priest or warlock, if I standard around completely visible to someone then a druid or rogue just comes up and 2 shots me down.
I think you really need a stealthed class or additional help to be able to defend.
11-29-2007 @ 8:26AM
Mystical Parrot said...
i play defense often, even though i cant really succeed as it as a pve specced fire mage with a similar quantity of health.
But just being there is enough to see off one person and warn for help when theres more than i can deal with, also usually you'll have a partner or two depending on the BG.
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11-29-2007 @ 8:28AM
superfrank said...
How about this protocol for AB or EotS:
1) Noone leaves a flag if there are less than 1/2 people at the flag.
2) When you spawn at a GY you take over from the nearby defenders and they get to attack.
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11-29-2007 @ 8:30AM
fLUx said...
I don't defend much, because I'm a warlock.
Loads of classes could come and wipe me easy if I was on my own, if there was one of them I could proberly keep them feared until help arrived and I could finish him off without thinking he could stun me, kill me, and run off with the flag/get the base.
But warlocks (affliction here) are proberly best in either 1v1 (no rogue) or in a big group of both ally and horde, so you can tab > dots > tab > dots and then aim for whoever has the most hp left and fear + drain life them. I've often been dead watching my total dmg for the match keep rising and rising, still doing 200+ dmg /sec on each person while dead.
Proberly not the best tactic for honor farming but meh....hehe
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11-29-2007 @ 11:43AM
Wrenzo said...
"I don't defend much, because I'm a warlock."
Um...you must be playing wrong then, my friend. I'm a warlock and I love playing defense. True, it's great to have a stealthed Rogue or Druid hanging out, but if not I've got my Succubus or Fel Hunter at my side and a handful of ways to handle 1, 2 or even 3 attackers.
If you're in a BG for a quick (and single) honor mark then don't worry about defense.
11-29-2007 @ 12:05PM
jtrain said...
Gotta agree with fLUx...
As an affliction lock, I just feel much more useful to the overall effort if I'm in a fray, dotting everything that moves. This is especially true in the new AV, where I frequently come upon large scale battles. I stand just behind the mele line and dot away. I'm usually top 5 dps and kills for the bg.
On the other hand, I've defended a few times, and the oncoming rush targets me first and foremost. I get one or two dots off before I'm toast. And yeah, the rogues do a number on me.
So as opposed to spending half the bg waiting to rez at a graveyard, i choose to mostly play offense.
11-30-2007 @ 12:09AM
fLUx said...
@Wrenzo: Yeh, I can do OK-ish defending, but it never works out for me or my team, I always end up dead unless I manage to keep them feared and use some potions.
But when hunters come running upto me like they do, and hack the crap out of me, I have just enough time to hit HoT and get him fully feared, if there were 2 or more of them, I'm done for, all I can do is add all my dots (inc. UA if I have time, mainly so they dont try to dispell), and that will help who evers coming to kill them.
But at the end of the day, I can do alot more damage if I just stand in the middle of the BG and wait for horde running to our flag or to help allys running out with the horde flag....
Not played much AV, I'm mainly in WSG, but the same goes for all BGs....locks were never designed to defend, and while you can do it, other classes can do it better....
11-29-2007 @ 8:33AM
Drak said...
People refuse to play defense to to a lack of leadership, communication, or skill. One or two players on defense is worthless, while more is hard to achieve unless you have a premade and are directing your teammates over vent. One healer and two dps are more than enough to hold an AB base, however, as a disc priest, I've found that players will take a base, mount, and leave almost immidietly. As a result, my staying there is only suicide, so I'm forced to follow them, although I always state on Battleground chat that ---- is undefended. Usually I get some smart ass telling me to stay there at which point my reactive statement is always "What do you want me to do? Heal them to death?"
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11-29-2007 @ 12:36PM
Matthew Rossi said...
I've always wished you COULD heal them to death. There should be a spell in each pure healing spec that converts a normal heal to damage, perhaps with a cooldown or limited duration to balance it. BUt imagine if for ten seconds you could cast your max rank heal and have it damage attackers.
I'm sure it would be imbalanced, but I can dream.
11-29-2007 @ 8:37AM
Hokuto said...
I defend if others are defending. There's no point on defending at AV with 5 other people just to be stomped by 30 incoming horde.
On the other BGs, I defend whatever needs to be defended. I'm usually holding a node, even tho I find myself alone pretty often at AB. At least I can say "/bg Mine is lost, thanks for coming".
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